Tuesday, July 13, 2010

Illegal alien = automatic victim?

I'm an American citizen. My parents are citizens, & their parents before them.

I must show my ID when I'm in any of the following situations:

1. Pulled over by the police.
2. Making retail purchases with a credit card.
3. When I go in for a doctor's appointment.
4. When applying for a credit card/loan.
5. When applying for/renewing a driver's license or passport.
6. When seeking any kind of insurance.
7. When applying for college entrance.
8. When donating blood.
9. When obtaining certain prescription drugs.
10. When making some debit purchases, especially if I'm out of state.
11. When collecting a boarding pass for airline or train travel.
12. Etc., etc...

American citizens are required to prove who we are nearly every day.

Why do illegal aliens assume victim status when required to do likewise?

Why should they be exempt?

Why should American laws apply more stringently to compliant, peaceful citizens than they do to foreign delinquents?

Why should legal visitors get shoved aside in favor of freeloading intruders?

Mr. Holder/Obama, can you answer these questions? Governor Brewer surely can...


Z said...

I SO hope that somebody would ask Obama these questions...
Imagine if a custard maker in his shop saw Obama or Biden and ran down this list? I wonder how badly Biden would swear at HIM, right? :-)

Susannah said...

Yeah Z, me too...Bob Sheiffer had Eric Holder tete a tete for something like a half hour the other night, & NOT ONCE did he mention Arizona & the Fed's law suit against it's own countrymen.

Pansy, sycophantic "journalist."

(I'm getting really sick of this, Z.)

fuzzys dad said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
fuzzys dad said...

Great post.
I will cross post.

Craig said...

Hello, Susannah,

I came across your blog via that meanie forum of atheists and deists.

Do you think Americans should carry a passport or birth certificate at all times? A drivers license is not proof of citizenship.

Why do illegal aliens assume victim status when required to do likewise?

It's not about protecting undocumented workers, it's about protecting American citizens who happen to fit the profile from 'reasonable suspicion' (the actual language in the law) and risk being arrested for not carrying documentation that you and I wouldn't need to carry.

Also, immigration is the Constitutionally enumerated purview of the Federal gov.

I happen to agree that we have an immigration problem. Undoc. workers drive down wages. To call them "freeloaders", though, reveals ignorance of the issue on your part. The vast majority come here to work and work harder than most Americans.

I get why Arizonans are frustrated and want to do something but did you know that arrests and deportations are up since Obama took office? Did you know crime in Arizona is going down?

I suspect this is just another wedge issue meant to discredit our president.

P.S. You're more than welcome to join in at wearesmrt any time. It's easy to register. They even let me in.

Jim said...

Mr. Holder/Obama, can you answer these questions?

No need. I'll answer. These are absurd questions. I've never heard of anyone complaining about being asked for ID under these circumstances. I've never heard that aliens or anybody else is exempt from having to provide ID under these circumstances.

Try another tact. You got nothing here.

Gabriel R said...

exodus 22:21

Susannah said...

Craig~ Welcome! Glad to have you here. See below for a condensed version of my response to you. Oh, & next time you stop by, leave the patronizing condescension back at your self-identified "meanie forum."

Jim~ "I've never heard of anyone complaining about being asked for ID under these circumstances." and "I've never heard that aliens or anybody else is exempt from having to provide ID under these circumstances."

Oh, but they ARE complaining, & the Leftists DO want them exempt. If what you say is true, then what's all the fuss about AZ taking care of business?? Like Craig said, "immigration is the Constitutionally enumerated purview of the Federal gov." and they haven't done THEIR JOB for the past 3-4-5 administrations!

And don't give me the thing Craig did about "protecting American citizens who happen to fit the profile from 'reasonable suspicion'"
That's just as absurd...you both need to "Try another tact. You got nothing here."

Susannah said...

Gabe! Welcome. You're a man of so few words - & the ones you used aren't even yours.

Of course we are to show courtesy & kindness to strangers. Hospitality is a spiritual gift, meant to be used freely.

HOWEVER, when said 'aliens' begin to encroach upon our ability to care for, feed, clothe, nuture our own children in a safe culture, God does NOT demand that we abdicate those responsibilities, or that we allow ourselve to be violated. We ought not to be unkind, but we must have limits & laws.

I'm no theologian, but one thing I've learned: scripture is understood wbest ithin the totality of the Word, not slice by slice as you've attempted. We miss a LOT of what God has to say when we carve it up.

Susannah said...

Oh, & Gabe, my brother (Coast Guard) is very, very good @ not 'mistreating or oppressing' aliens. When a Coast Guard cutter picks up people on rafts between Florida & Cuba, they take them aboard, tend their sunburned, windburned, cracked & peeling skin. They give them fluids, medical care, a nice hot shower, a warm meal. And then they take them home.

And then there are the drug runners...not so much hospitality for them, I'm afraid. But you're probably mad about that, too, right?

Jim said...

Oh, but they ARE complaining, & the Leftists DO want them exempt.

This is absurdly untrue. Laughably false. How can you write it with a straight face?

Everything mentioned in your list is common credit or ID check and has nothing to do with immigration and thus there is no reason to complain and no reason whatsoever for libruls to want anybody to be exempt. So they don't.

Or please provide evidence of your claim. And don't tell me to Google it. You can't Google a negative.

Craig said...


Thanks for the warm welcome.

I reread my last comment looking for patronizing condescension. Was it the "ignorant on the issue" observation?

Just so I can be clear, what is your position/ solution to the illegal immigrant problem?

For the record, I'm a Lefty, a Liberal, a Progressive. Whatever you'd like to call me. From the few posts I've read of yours, I'm pretty far left of you, politically. In a historical context, that would put me smack dab in the middle.

I hope you don't mind if I stop by from time to time for some spirited, civil debate.

Quasar said...

"Why do illegal aliens assume victim status when required to do likewise?"

Do they? As far as I've seen, anyone caught doing something illegal gets arrested, fined, or otherwise punished according to the law.

Could you show me where criminals caught engaging in criminal acts are treated as victims under your laws? That seems like a serious flaw.

"Why should they be exempt?"

The shouldn't.

Mullmeister said...

And to think, i was thinking of visiting the states.

On a serious note, i thought i would provide a more international perspective.

It is the same all over. Its just that in my opinion some people are less likely to be asked for identification i.e. A OAP buying alcohol or in my case- being mixed race but from germany, if it werent for my accent i would be far more likely to be stopped and asked for ID.

The authorities do not have the time to stop and ask every single person so they must be selective over who gets stopped. Its the same everywhere i have lived.

However, as for claiming 'victim status' those minorities and illegals are far more likely to complain.

As for carrying ID - its for your own benefit that you should anyway incase something happens. And being asked for it - be happy that an officer is concerned enough to be protecting citizens like you by checking the status of other people on the street.

Susannah said...

Hey all~
Well, well, lots going on while I've been busy...

I could tease through the individual questions posed of me - and on another day I may have time for that. Let's suffice to say - for tonight - read our new friend Mullmeister's comment. Then read it again.

In answer to all your questions, I'll say, "What he said!"

Susannah said...

btw, Thanks for stopping by, Mull. Great to have you here!

Gabriel R said...

psalm 17:10

Susannah said...

Gabe~ I'll never have "the last word" with a guy like you - one who carves up scripture to suit his argument, wielding it as a weapon...

There's nothing callous whatsoever about holding the expectation that people will abide by the laws of the land. And there's nothing arrogant, whatsoever about saying so...

We could banter back & forth, tossing scripture like darts to accuse one another...but no thanks. That's inappropriate for either of us, & unbecoming of people of the Word, no?

If you have something to say, be my guest, but continue this angle, & I'll delete it. I promise.

Gabriel R said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
The Black Widow said...

Dear Sista....I love your liscense story....I'm 43 and don't get carded often...but wait...I actually was born in the United States...And I hear to be legal in this country you have to go to school and get a green card?

Hello......Does anyone know how much more your paying on your taxes...in your county of each state because Illegal Aliens are not charged for anything medical???Yes Medical expenses for free. Right now *I'm looking for a country I can move to even if its illegal. One where maybe I can get the same fricken deal as all these people..........Who are NOT>>>>>legal.....

Oh...sorry I barely know you...but I love your blog on this subject and thank you I feel much better after getting that off my chest.


The Black Widow

Mullmeister said...

@Black Widow.

I am assuming your American and therefore the simple answer to your question is go to Mexico where these 'illegals' come from. There, or in any other developing country, you will get the same rights as everyone else- whatever you can afford.

Conversely, you will probably be getting more than the locals if you are a white American. Being white, male and between the age of 18 - 40 in this world seems to put people slightly ahead of others.

I have lived in 4 developing countries over the past 5 years and being there has shown me that people will never be equal, any white foreigner is treated with more respect and kindness in most cases. Even by those who have nothing.

As for illegals recieving free healthcare: They cant afford it and in my opinion, I dont mind some of my tax money going out to help the less fortunate. They may be illegal but it is a human right to have access to healthcare. If you were the one in need of the healthcare and could not afford it, you would get it, no matter where you are. 3 years ago I was in Sudan and being a real ~#@?head and got shot it the thigh. I had no money or ID or anything on me and i recieved FREE treatment from a local clinic. They have no healthcare system and it is not meant to be free for anyone but i got it.

@Susannah- Sorry to go ranting on your comments section, some things really push my buttons.

The Black Widow said...

Dear Mullemeister: See your missing the point young one. These people are here Illegally. I'm glad you received free health care in another country and your ok. My point was......People should pay their fair of taxes.......I dont give a rats ass if they live here but they ought to become "A LEGAL Citizen"....When your 43 and pay 28% of your income to stuff like this then come to me and tell me I'm a dum ass. Until then dont.

Mullmeister said...

@ Black Widow. I do see where you are comming from and you do have a point.


1. Not all your tax money goes to these people.

2. I may be a 'young one' but i am not calling you a dumb ass. Since i was 16 i too have paid 22% of my income to such things. I served in the army and have seen and done things to these people in their countries so I am sorry but I sympathise with them.

3. I too will allow you to call me a dumb ass when you have watched children starve to death in IDP camps, knowing you have 3 warm meals a day waiting back at base, which are the result of our consumerism. But that is a different arguement.

Let us agree to disagree, all the best Black Widow. Sir.

The Black Widow said...

Mullmeister: We can agree to disagree on issue #1. The issue is I'm a U.S. Citzen and even if I lose my job I still have to pay taxes (FACT). If an Illegal Alien loses his job he's not paying taxes. I did a piece a while ago about illegal aliens and my idea was to put higher taxes on Imports to offset the amount of money the hospitals and clinics are forking out on Illegal Aliens (our Country gets killed on Imports and Exports).

Issue #2 I did not bring up but since you did I do not like any type of child starving. Many times money that is going to third world countries is intercepted by the people running the Country. There is no need to call you dumb ass in this situation this is not good. I wish I new how we could all improve this sitution. Seems like all countries would rather spend more on High Tech gadgets than worrying about kids. Its a sad thing.

Susannah said...

Hi Black Widow~ Thanks for coming by, for your comments, & for the follow. I haven't been ignoring your & Mull's comments. My family & I are in the middle of our vacation & we have limited internet access. Sorry if I can't tease it all through...

Nonetheless, I appreciate your visits, & your kind words. Oh, & folks are welcome to 'get things off their chest' here any time!

Mull! So glad you're back, & feeling free to rant!! (See, BW?)

I've only got a few minutes...
"Being white, male and between the age of 18 - 40 in this world seems to put people slightly ahead of others."
I'm not sure that's entirely true. Though, I am caucasian; but not male, nor have I lived in any country save the US. However, it seems to me that there's a large pendulum swinging, & in recent decades it has begun to swing away (not remaining in the center, mind you) from demographic you mention - in the US, anyway (college admissions, medical school admissions, job opportunities, etc.). My husband deals w/ it in his workplace - he deals a lot w/ Govt contracts, & has lost many a 'job' b/c he is in the demographic you described; and has been told so to his face... It's why I worry for our sons sometimes...for their opportunities going forward. But I'm no sociologist...

As for illegals & free healthcare: "They cant afford it and in my opinion, I dont mind some of my tax money going out to help the less fortunate."
The trouble with this in the US is that the 'free' healthcare is driving our country into bankruptcy. It isn't free to those who pay into the tax system.

Illegals are not coming here as visitors, like you did in the Sudan, having accidents & needing emergency care. You absolutely needed it, & thank God you received. But you didn't intend to stay in the country, give birth 5 times, get in gov't subsidized housing, govt. subsidized food stamps, education, etc., all w/o paying anything into the tax system.

Trouble is, illegals are coming here, staying here, not matriculating into the society (as immigrants have historically done), getting 'benefits', NOT paying into the tax system - at all . The result is sucking the systems dry: medical, educational, welfare, etc. And if you hear a Liberal tell you it's not, you're hearing a lie...We cannot even take care of our elderly citizens (Social Security), much less other country's .

The argument, in my mind, is not about whether human beings deserve kindness & compassion (which can/should be done by churches, etc. - who used to take these burdens on, but aren't so much anymore), but about the larger issue of the survival of the structure of our society.

and to Craig~ "Just so I can be clear, what is your position/ solution to the illegal immigrant problem?"
I'm not sure if that's a 'shut you up' kind of question...but since I don't know you, I'll assume it's legit.

And it's a good question. And I don't know...but I KNOW that Amnesty-to-build-a-voting-base for 12 mill. illegal people is NOT the answer. Giving people who came here illegally their citizenship is a slap in the face to people who've done it the right way.

This is a question that must be given SERIOUS policy discussion, not cynical vote-pandering. It's too critical an issue (healthcare burden, education system burden, prison system burden, tax burden, etc.) to be made political...

So, what's your answer?

OK. That's all I have time for, friends. Thanks again for your grace in allowing me so much time to respond. These last few weeks have been crazy & we won't be home for several days yet...

Have a great end of summer!